I read the issue with deep interest, but concluded this would not apply to the Trumpeter Swan, where exactly are you referring. I just reread it and still come to the same conclusion. From what I am reading, we are talking about initial sightings in the ABA area as a whole. Once on the list, we would go to the rules about reintroduced or introduced species. I don't see where the Trumpeter does not reach those thresholds?
-----Original Message-----
From: Andrew Sewell <[log in to unmask]>
To: dinobaseball7 <[log in to unmask]>
Cc: ohio-birds <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Sun, Dec 8, 2013 8:05 pm
Subject: Re: [Ohio-birds] Trumpeter Swans?
The ABA recently put out a publication addressing this very issue, The Birder's Guide to Listing and Taxonomy (readable online here: http://bg.aba.org/i/205710 ). There's a great article that explains the interplay between state and ABA listing. Essentially, unless there is a compelling reason otherwise, the ABA defers to the state bird records committee on issues such as this. Now, if someone wants to present a formal argument to the OBRC for the establishment of the bird species, then I'm sure they'd love to review it. But for the reasons that Bill posted, I think it will be a while yet for this large, slow-breeding bird to be truly established. Once they start breeding at Pickerington Ponds, maybe...
Andy Sewell
Columbus, Ohio
On Sun, Dec 8, 2013 at 7:58 PM, Dino Costanzo <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Before saying anything on this issue, I want to say that I respect Bill and this response is nothing more than a disagreement in his opinion and those that hold his view in some way. I had a chance to talk first hand with an Ohio Division Biologist on this issue and I was informed that Trumpeter Swans in Ohio are on their 3rd Generation at this point. That means we have had 2 cycles of successful breeding in the wild on their own since the reintroduction or introduction process has begun. If we take the argument that a species was introduced into an area by man, we run the risk of saying that all introduced species are actually not countable. Seeing that Bird Listing is a game or sport and those that attempt to play by one particular association rules, I am referring to the ABA, the way I have read the rules or interpret them, I would deem the Trumpeter Swan as a bird that can now be listed in Ohio. The Trumpeter appears on the ABA Checklist and that means that the bird now can be considered. In reading the rule on deeming a bird that has been reintroduced or introduced, the Trumpeter would clear those hurtles at this point. It is my understanding that once a bird is accepted on the ABA checklist, rules or decisions by a state committee do not ultimately determine weather one can count the bird. It is also my understanding that Ohio has never made a determination, weather the Trumpeter population is now wild or not wild. I have researched this for over 3 months and sent to many individuals and organizations, just looking for an opinion. I have only received one response and that was after making direct contact. No one has elected to weigh in. Depending what list you are working with can make a difference, but for the sake of the ABA, I can see no reason not to TIC the Trumpeter. I have seen over 200 birds at 7 different locations and was never able to get closer than 100 yards, maybe. States around us have deemed the bird as countable and there has been some migrational movement of these breeding birds. I have read no less than 40 different articles and maybe a hundred opinions on this I have found on the Internet. The last release was 2002, I believe, but the balance were released between 1996-98. I may be off by just a bit, because I am not looking at the articles, but they are all easily accessible on the Internet. Dino Costanzo
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Whan <[log in to unmask]>
To: OHIO-BIRDS <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Sun, Dec 8, 2013 8:53 am
Subject: Re: [Ohio-birds] Trumpeter Swans?
Most birders have agreed on comparing their various lists by recognizing
only those birds that are of wild origin and observed in person free and
unrestrained, as well as correctly identified as to species. Most of us
don't count the chukars or sharp-tailed grouse we may see here.
First of all, a count of 150 trumpeter swans at Killdeer Plains seems
too large to me. You might be able to round up that many if you gathered
together most of the introduced Ohio population, leaving out the large
number of migrant tundra swans that gather at various spots--like KPWA--
in Ohio in early winter. Silent trumpeter and tundra swans are
devilishly difficult to discriminate in the field without direct
comparisons.
Ohio is only one among several Midwestern states and provinces that
were persuaded in the '90s by waterfowl enthusiasts to foster
populations of trumpeters. While some of their populations introduced in
the state have winked out, several remain, including at Killdeer Plains
WA. Their numbers have not changed much, and they have not independently
enlarged their Ohio range. There is no evidence wild trumpeters ever
nested in Ohio, and verifiable records of migrant trumpeters in the good
old days before humans started introducing alien species (or stopped
wiping out native swans for the feather trade--a trumpeter swan has more
feathers than any other bird species) are very hard to come by.
The Ohio checklist does not recognize these birds as established.
Despite protections, their population has not grown in a normal
anticipated way, and has winked out in certain areas and required
artificial translocations in others. Unlike wild trumpeters, they do not
undertake normal seasonal migrations. Trumpeter swans are of course
established native birds in North America, and are known to have
occurred here in small numbers as migrants back before their nearby
populations were largely wiped out, but there are no verified records
since then. There are a number of archaeological finds of swan bones
from Ohio. If you want to count one, the closest wild native birds are
hundreds of miles away, and well worth the trip. On the other hand, a
lot of the Killdeer birds are easy to approach, and will gladly accept
potato chips.
Bill Whan
Columbus
On 12/7/2013 5:41 PM, Jeff Harvey wrote:
> Recent discussions among various birders on the countability of
> Trumpeters has me confused. Today a report of 150 Trumpeters at
> Killdeer was posted on the listserv. Under the assumption that the
> identification is correct, why are these birds not countable?
>
> The records committee bird list says that records only up to the year
> 1900 have been accepted and that an introduction program began in
> 1996. Am I to believe that the birds seen today are decendents from
> introduced Ohio birds? If so, would these birds constitute an
> established species in Ohio as is indicated in the records committee
> checklist or not? The checklist seems to indcate that once
> established they would be countable.
>
> Even if these birds are migrants, why are they not countable? We
> count migrants all the time.
>
> How will we know when the species is established and countable?
>
> Jeff Harvey Mahoning County
>
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Please consider joining our Society, at www.ohiobirds.org/site/membership.php.
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