The ABA recently put out a publication addressing this very issue, The Birder's Guide to Listing and Taxonomy (readable online here: http://bg.aba.org/i/205710 ). There's a great article that explains the interplay between state and ABA listing. Essentially, unless there is a compelling reason otherwise, the ABA defers to the state bird records committee on issues such as this. Now, if someone wants to present a formal argument to the OBRC for the establishment of the bird species, then I'm sure they'd love to review it. But for the reasons that Bill posted, I think it will be a while yet for this large, slow-breeding bird to be truly established. Once they start breeding at Pickerington Ponds, maybe... Andy Sewell Columbus, Ohio On Sun, Dec 8, 2013 at 7:58 PM, Dino Costanzo <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Before saying anything on this issue, I want to say that I respect Bill > and this response is nothing more than a disagreement in his opinion and > those that hold his view in some way. I had a chance to talk first hand > with an Ohio Division Biologist on this issue and I was informed that > Trumpeter Swans in Ohio are on their 3rd Generation at this point. That > means we have had 2 cycles of successful breeding in the wild on their own > since the reintroduction or introduction process has begun. If we take the > argument that a species was introduced into an area by man, we run the risk > of saying that all introduced species are actually not countable. Seeing > that Bird Listing is a game or sport and those that attempt to play by one > particular association rules, I am referring to the ABA, the way I have > read the rules or interpret them, I would deem the Trumpeter Swan as a bird > that can now be listed in Ohio. The Trumpeter appears on the ABA Checklist > and that means that the bird now can be considered. In reading the rule on > deeming a bird that has been reintroduced or introduced, the Trumpeter > would clear those hurtles at this point. It is my understanding that once a > bird is accepted on the ABA checklist, rules or decisions by a state > committee do not ultimately determine weather one can count the bird. It is > also my understanding that Ohio has never made a determination, weather the > Trumpeter population is now wild or not wild. I have researched this for > over 3 months and sent to many individuals and organizations, just looking > for an opinion. I have only received one response and that was after making > direct contact. No one has elected to weigh in. Depending what list you are > working with can make a difference, but for the sake of the ABA, I can see > no reason not to TIC the Trumpeter. I have seen over 200 birds at 7 > different locations and was never able to get closer than 100 yards, maybe. > States around us have deemed the bird as countable and there has been some > migrational movement of these breeding birds. I have read no less than 40 > different articles and maybe a hundred opinions on this I have found on the > Internet. The last release was 2002, I believe, but the balance were > released between 1996-98. I may be off by just a bit, because I am not > looking at the articles, but they are all easily accessible on the > Internet. Dino Costanzo > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bill Whan <[log in to unmask]> > To: OHIO-BIRDS <[log in to unmask]> > Sent: Sun, Dec 8, 2013 8:53 am > Subject: Re: [Ohio-birds] Trumpeter Swans? > > > Most birders have agreed on comparing their various lists by recognizing > only those birds that are of wild origin and observed in person free and > unrestrained, as well as correctly identified as to species. Most of us > don't count the chukars or sharp-tailed grouse we may see here. > First of all, a count of 150 trumpeter swans at Killdeer Plains > seems > too large to me. You might be able to round up that many if you gathered > together most of the introduced Ohio population, leaving out the large > number of migrant tundra swans that gather at various spots--like KPWA-- > in Ohio in early winter. Silent trumpeter and tundra swans are > devilishly difficult to discriminate in the field without direct > comparisons. > Ohio is only one among several Midwestern states and provinces that > were persuaded in the '90s by waterfowl enthusiasts to foster > populations of trumpeters. While some of their populations introduced in > the state have winked out, several remain, including at Killdeer Plains > WA. Their numbers have not changed much, and they have not independently > enlarged their Ohio range. There is no evidence wild trumpeters ever > nested in Ohio, and verifiable records of migrant trumpeters in the good > old days before humans started introducing alien species (or stopped > wiping out native swans for the feather trade--a trumpeter swan has more > feathers than any other bird species) are very hard to come by. > The Ohio checklist does not recognize these birds as established. > Despite protections, their population has not grown in a normal > anticipated way, and has winked out in certain areas and required > artificial translocations in others. Unlike wild trumpeters, they do not > undertake normal seasonal migrations. Trumpeter swans are of course > established native birds in North America, and are known to have > occurred here in small numbers as migrants back before their nearby > populations were largely wiped out, but there are no verified records > since then. There are a number of archaeological finds of swan bones > from Ohio. If you want to count one, the closest wild native birds are > hundreds of miles away, and well worth the trip. On the other hand, a > lot of the Killdeer birds are easy to approach, and will gladly accept > potato chips. > Bill Whan > Columbus > > On 12/7/2013 5:41 PM, Jeff Harvey wrote: > > Recent discussions among various birders on the countability of > > Trumpeters has me confused. Today a report of 150 Trumpeters at > > Killdeer was posted on the listserv. Under the assumption that the > > identification is correct, why are these birds not countable? > > > > The records committee bird list says that records only up to the year > > 1900 have been accepted and that an introduction program began in > > 1996. Am I to believe that the birds seen today are decendents from > > introduced Ohio birds? If so, would these birds constitute an > > established species in Ohio as is indicated in the records committee > > checklist or not? The checklist seems to indcate that once > > established they would be countable. > > > > Even if these birds are migrants, why are they not countable? We > > count migrants all the time. > > > > How will we know when the species is established and countable? > > > > Jeff Harvey Mahoning County > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > Ohio-birds mailing list, a service of the Ohio Ornithological Society. > Please consider joining our Society, at > www.ohiobirds.org/site/membership.php. > Our thanks to Miami University for hosting this mailing list. > > > You can join or leave the list, or change your options, at: > listserv.muohio.edu/scripts/wa.exe?LIST=OHIO-BIRDS > Send questions or comments about the list to: [log in to unmask] > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > Ohio-birds mailing list, a service of the Ohio Ornithological Society. > Please consider joining our Society, at > www.ohiobirds.org/site/membership.php. > Our thanks to Miami University for hosting this mailing list. > > > You can join or leave the list, or change your options, at: > listserv.muohio.edu/scripts/wa.exe?LIST=OHIO-BIRDS > Send questions or comments about the list to: [log in to unmask] > ______________________________________________________________________ Ohio-birds mailing list, a service of the Ohio Ornithological Society. Please consider joining our Society, at www.ohiobirds.org/site/membership.php. Our thanks to Miami University for hosting this mailing list. You can join or leave the list, or change your options, at: listserv.muohio.edu/scripts/wa.exe?LIST=OHIO-BIRDS Send questions or comments about the list to: [log in to unmask]