Rich Bradley apparently planned to post this on the list, so here it is. Historically speaking, he refers to posts here way back on 7/26. -------- Original Message -------- Subject: historical data etc. Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2014 06:33:27 -0400 From: Rich Bradley <[log in to unmask]> To: [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask] Bob, I read your reply to Bill Whan's post on the ABA Ohio listserve. Your rather glum assessment is probably accurate, but I do think that there is great value in understanding context. The only way we can convince people that we are in crisis is to demonstrate how much change has occurred. As each of us grows up in a "different" world (in terms of personal experience), we get an impression. Through our lives, things change. If we assume that the change we observe in our lives is all that has happened, we are very mistaken. This is the classic "shifting baselines" issue. I used to teach this in my general biology classes, illustrated with a series of landings at a particular sport fishing pier over a period of a century of so. The landings in recent years look robust, until you look at what people used to catch on their one day fishing trips two generations ago. It is quite sobering and made the point very quickly to first year college students. Bill (If I may speak for you) is doing a search for some of that lost context. I must confess I've not heard anything about the manuscript he is searching for, but it would be an interesting find. I'm constantly confronted with people who say that the world is in fine shape, no problems. Look at all that green, all those critters. They justdon't see the difference between exotic introduced species and the vanishing native fauna. If they don't have any comparative baseline, they think that the natural world is in just fine shape. Sort of the frog in the gradually warming pot's view. Just my .02$ worth, Rich PS: I can't figure out how to keep my login credentials active on the list, and I've given up trying. I just lurk out here, watching without posting. I've tried a few posts, but it never works for me. If either of you chooses to include (quote) my comments in a post to the list, I'd be fine with that. -- Rich Bradley Associate Professor, EEO Biology The Ohio State University at Marion ______________________________________________________________________ Ohio-birds mailing list, a service of the Ohio Ornithological Society. Please consider joining our Society, at www.ohiobirds.org/site/membership.php. Our thanks to Miami University for hosting this mailing list. You can join or leave the list, or change your options, at: listserv.miamioh.edu/scripts/wa.exe?LIST=OHIO-BIRDS Send questions or comments about the list to: [log in to unmask]